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Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

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Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

Post by Fr8trainShane on Mon Jan 03, 2011 4:17 pm

Since i'm not on the GC, I'll submit these for you guys to review. Some are amendments to existing rules, others are new rules.

Rule 1: 3 Strike System
Institute a 3 strike system. Minor violations like IOR, nano blitz, controlling a blocker on returns result in a warning first, and then every subsequent occurence is a strike. Accusers must provide video replay of the violations (this make IORs hard I realize). 1 Strikes and your next opponent is given a CPU game. 2 Strikes and your next 3 opponents get CPU games, and on the 3rd strike, you are moved from the league.

Rule 2: Quitting/Conceding
Quitting or Conceding at any time during a game, will result in the the abuser losing the game, and be given an immediate strike in the above system. Conceding is only acceptable, if the game is paused, and you post in the league message board that you are conceding the game (give the score AND quarter) and your opponent has to post to accept the concede. The opponent is given the win. This will stop people bickering about "so and so msg'd me" and blah blah blah. Its quantifiable, and its a paper trail.

Rule 3 (Amendment to the Punt Rule):
If you are up, you can only go for 4th and less than on opponents side of the field. No NFL team is going to risk bad field position with a lead.
-Tie Score - You can go for 4th and inches outside of your forty. 4th and longer you must punt.
-Down by 8 or less (1 score) - You can go for 4th and 2 on opponents side of the field.
-Down by 9-14 - You can go for 4th and 2 outside of your forty (moves back 10 yards because of 2 score differential)
-Down by 15+ (Only in the 2nd Half) - You can go for 4th an inches anywhere, 4th and 3 or less outside your 40 (Only in 2nd half, else u punt).
-Fourth Quarter, if you are down by 2 scores, you can go for it anywhere anytime.

Rule 4: Establishment of a 3 person Review Team
In the event a player has a complaint regarding game play or rules, they may submit video evidence to the Team who will render judgement.
Upon review of the video evidence, the members of the team will post their findings (with all 3 persons findings).
The Team may decide:
a) The violation deserves an immediate strike in the above 3 strike system
b) The violation is minor, and therefore only deserves a warning.
c) The violation is unintended, or is an unknown new glitch/action, for which a rule proposal must then be made to stop further abuses.

Rule 5: Video proof must accompany all complaints
If its not on video, you can not submit a complaint to Review team and/or Commissioner.
Video can be EA Highlights, or cell phone video, or any other type of video.

Rule 6 (proposed by Cheddah) QB sub Rule:

There will be no substituting a QB in or out of the game more than once unless it is for use in the WILDCAT or Bronco Heavy formations, or due to injury. This is to mimic real NFL situations where a QB would be subbed out. In NO other circumstances does any NFL team use special QBs.


I think these are a few decent rule proposals, that might help clean up some of the high school cheerleader drama that goes on around here.

Thoughts?

For now, members of the GC please vote on these 6 rules. In the format "1- For/Against: Reason. 2- For/Against: Reason...etc" Thank You!


Last edited by Fr8trainShane on Mon Jan 03, 2011 4:38 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

Post by jmojsoski on Mon Jan 03, 2011 4:28 pm

I like em all... Especially rule 2&5
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Re: Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

Post by Cheddah_Cheez on Mon Jan 03, 2011 4:33 pm

I like all these as well. However, as a commish, I take complaints without proof...I don't take any action except letting the player know...but I keep a log. If i see one guy is constnatly being complained about by different guys, he's probably doing something wrong. After all, if it looks like a duck, smells like a duck, and 7 people just told you it's a duck...it usually is. But all those rules a great, they'd have my vote.
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Re: Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

Post by Cheddah_Cheez on Mon Jan 03, 2011 4:37 pm

Shane I hope you don't take offense to this. But you can't do it so I'm gonna sticky this topic and make it the designated Rule submittal topic. I'm also going to add my proposed rule to your list but Will indicate as such.
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Re: Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

Post by GREENERRRR on Mon Jan 03, 2011 4:38 pm

rule 1 - like it - its the unfooficial standard that most commish go by - problem is VIDEO EVIDENCE is notoriously UNRELIABLE - many plays are not shown and its only the action during the play that are seen - manuy of our rules actually focus on PRESNAP action..

i am buying a new PVR digital satelite reciever - hoping to TAPE ALL GAMES AND MAKE video evidence 100% possible for every play i play in - but not every1 has a PVR of the finanancial resources to buy it - so a small disconect between members there,,,

Rule 2 - not sure guys would be willing to come online to post they are conceding just to forgo 9 0 seconds of watching a QB kneel.... but in the end - maybe thats a good thing... BUT thats gonna effect our NON ACCEL CLOCK FRANCHISES adversely - if a guy is TOTALLY OUT OF THE GAME - and the accel clock is not on - he has another opponent waiting to play him (or his GF is bugging him to eat dinner or w/e!) could be an issue there... PERSONALLY i think the problem isnt with guys quiting and conceding online franchise games - ITS WITH GUYS QUITING CPU GAMES to escape gratuitous injurios to key players...

RULE 3 - like the rule - but if possible would like to it MORE SIMPLIFIED - KISS (keep it simple stupid) is a good policy to keep in mind when writing rules - SIMPLE - EASY TO UNDERSTYAND RULES make it more accomodating for people to follow...

RULE 4 and 5 - thats kinda the job of the commish - seems redundent to have 3 people watch a video which should be CLEAR AS A DAY... and the standard of VIDEO evdidence is already in place and is an absolute must- if i acted on every complaint i had w/oi video evidence their wouldnt be any1 left in the MG
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Re: Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

Post by Fr8trainShane on Mon Jan 03, 2011 4:41 pm

@Cheddah - No offense at all brother. I'm happy to help. Just trying to do my part I suppose lol


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Re: Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

Post by Fr8trainShane on Mon Jan 03, 2011 4:43 pm

@Greenerrrr - While I'm also a fan of keeping it simple, I think its a rule that has to be enhanced, simple because it encompasses Down, Distance, and Score.
Not sure it can be dumbed down, without losing its effectiveness. Any suggestions?

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Re: Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

Post by Cheddah_Cheez on Mon Jan 03, 2011 4:46 pm

1- For: Great policy of punishment

2. - Against: Messaging on the board mid game would take hella long time...especially if it was just to concede a game.

3 - For: I like the punt rule as is, but this is more detailed and takes out the in your own territory aspect of it so I like it better this way.

4 - For

5- For: Makes my job as commish easier

6 - For: No team employs a 2 QB system because it doesn't work.
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Re: Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

Post by saastar on Mon Jan 03, 2011 4:56 pm

rule 1 i dont like bc there has been atleast 3 times when i played an opponent and tried to get video evidence to show their was nothing really there due to the fact of the way madden does its ea highlights u could not find the right highlight and it not show the whole play well at all so the commish has to make a judgemental call.. which could result in a 2nd strike and 3 cpu games that are not deserved...

rule 2 is ok but the whole thing with having to send a message and all that on the boards i think is not necessary bc like greenerrr said if ur playing like in his green 2 lg where there is no accelerated clock and u have to pause the game go to ur computer then send a message on the site then wait for the other guy to send a message back on the forums it could take alittle bit and if u got 2 or 3 games to play that nite u dont really have time to be doing all that. much easier just to send it over psn message and do it that way..


rule3-5 have no problems with at all they all sound good to me..


rule 6.. i completely disagree with. bc in madden 2010 u actually had a wildcat formation that would work worth a damn like the arizona playbook had a great wildcat.. but in this years madden there is not 1 single wildcat formation that works.. so u would be limiting play calling bc many could argue yeah u dont see it in nfl besides wildcat or goaline or any of that bs.. but u know u have seen it in the nfl.. where early this season the eagles would sub in mike vike and he was not in wild cat or goal line and he would come in and run out of shotgun and either pass the ball or run with it.. and kevin kolb was the starter early in the season.. so u cant say its unsim bc its used in the NFL besides only in wildcat...

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Re: Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

Post by Cheddah_Cheez on Mon Jan 03, 2011 5:05 pm

Saastar, I'm not getting into this debate with you here, there's a topic for that. However, I watch the eagles all the time, and this year no they did not use vick outside of the wildcat...that was last year and he would MAYBE see 3 snaps a game. The plays he ran were wildcat plays, usually misdirections where he ended up sweeping around the edge. Second, if that was the case AND it worked...they'd still employ that system. My rule is not restricting anyone's play calling. I'm not disallowing wildcat or anything. I'm disallowing people to sub in QBs so they can run around on 3rd and long and take advantage of people's inability to prepare for it. If you want to play with the benefits of a scrambling QB do so, but you can't keep switching between both, that's bullshit.
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Re: Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

Post by ezweightloss on Mon Jan 03, 2011 5:25 pm

1. against. i think it is fine the way it is and this will further complicate things like keeping count of people's "strikes" i think we all know a cheezer when we see one.

2. against. i think if you are down by an insurmountable number you should be able to concede. i always accept another members option to concede. we all know who is gonna win so why waste extra 30 mins-1 hour playing out a meaningless second half. (i.e. in greener 1 i went up 56-3 on ivan IN THE FIRST HALF, well all know greener's game take ridiculously long to play. why would i not let him concede? after that it's not even fun for either party because by rule and sportmanship you have to run on every down and wait for the play clock to go down, it becomes miserable.) also another factor is injury. i don't want my star players getting hurt in a now meaningless game and i don't wanna waste my time by manually subbing at every single position.

3. no comment. it's very complicated and people will always say i thought this was this and that was that. i thought 4&2 on my 40 not 4&2 on your 40 and all this other crap. i would be fine with this being installed but i think it will cause problems down the road. i already get people going for it in illegal situation with the current rule which is quite simple and then they send a long ass message of how they "thought" it was legal.

4. no comment once again. i think it is a good idea but in the end it should come down to the commish of each league. i know i don't want anyone telling me who i can and can't have in my league. i know when someone is bad news and can hurt my franchise and i will take the proper actions regardless of other people's opinion on a flawed replay system.

5. against. in this year's madden we all know the replay system is flawed so unless you have an external camera this is virtually impossible.

6. for. i think everything chedda has said on this subject sums up my beliefs as well. though i do understand subbing a backup qb in a goaline package to play safe and prevent injury on a qb sneak.

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Re: Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

Post by saastar on Mon Jan 03, 2011 5:36 pm

well i dont think its bullshit just bc u dont know which qb is in.. i mean in my games now i dont sub them in our out.. i just sub in the faster 1 into a 5 wr set and leave the pocket passer in on other formations.. and i knew it was either this yr or last year.. but out of the 3 plays he would not always sweep and try to run to the edge.. sometimes he would stand in the pocket and actually be looking to throw the football.. i mean im not here to argue either.. i just dont think u should have to sub and leave him in or u can only sub him in if ur qb is injured.. bc say someone is blitzing like sick and stick does or someone is blitzing heavy and i cant do nothing with a pocket passer bc of his blitz is getting to fast to my qb before i have to act.. so i sub in a qb mainly in 5 wr sets and with his mobility gives me more time to act...

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Re: Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

Post by phantomshark on Mon Jan 03, 2011 5:51 pm

I feel very strongly that the subbing the QB rule is not a good one. The Jets sub in Brad Smith all the time, and use him in both Wildcat and standard packages. Tebow comes in sometimes for Denver, VIck used to sub in for Kolb before he became the starter. If the WIldcat sets were more extensive in the game then I might agree, but for now not allowing the backup QB into the game occasionally would serve no purpose other than to make another arbitrary rule. Oh and for the record, I do not sub my QBs in any of my leagues, but that doesn't mean I shouldn't be able to if I don't want to.

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Re: Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

Post by Rui_F on Mon Jan 03, 2011 5:54 pm

I would add one more. No disrespecting your opponent: before,during and after games. If you don't have nothing nice to say keep your mouth shut.

Any fuck you messages, your skills suck all that crap goes out the window.

If you message someone about a rule break or glitch and you get one of these back then you have the precedence to forward to the commish. 3 of these and they get banned from the league period. Civility is a must, i am not your buddy that grew up with you and I don't care if your joking or having fun or whatever.

Adrenaline is a funny thing and some of you seem to get too much of it from playing a video game. Makes your mouths say funny shit and your brains shut down.
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Re: Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

Post by GREENERRRR on Mon Jan 03, 2011 6:16 pm

Rui_F wrote:I would add one more. No disrespecting your opponent: before,during and after games. If you don't have nothing nice to say keep your mouth shut.

Any fuck you messages, your skills suck all that crap goes out the window.

If you message someone about a rule break or glitch and you get one of these back then you have the precedence to forward to the commish. 3 of these and they get banned from the league period. Civility is a must, i am not your buddy that grew up with you and I don't care if your joking or having fun or whatever.

Adrenaline is a funny thing and some of you seem to get too much of it from playing a video game. Makes your mouths say funny shit and your brains shut down.

u have a good point here RUI - and i believe i am totally misinderstood in some of the messages i have sent after a game... If i call a PLAY MADDEN BS - THATS NOT AN ATTACK ON YOU - its an attack on the game and ITS WELL DOCUMENTED INADEQUACIES - clearly some people dont make that distinction and take it PERSONAL -

but I AM ALWAYS CONSISTANT - if i get a MADDEN BS PLAY that goes for me - I AM THE 1ST PERSON THAT RECOGNIZES AND CALLS IT OUT AS BEING SO!!!! (so if i call MADDEN BS PLAYS out that benefit you - thats mo attack on you - JUST MY VIEW OF THE GAME...

1 thing i have noticed about this game (and this is part of the reason i am so DILIGENT of recognizing the BS MADDEN PLAYS that benefit me) -is that players OFTEN only see the BS MADDEN PLAYS that go against them - and RARELY see the BS MADDEN PLAYS that they benefit from - its human nature i suppose...

here is a perfect example (and once again i will leavce names out of it b/c its not important) played a game recently where the player DESTROYED THE THRESHOLD OF THE 20% RULE - (actually he broke the rule TWICE with 2 different plays - each run well over 20%) - but i had poor executuon by my QB and there was no way I DESERVED TO WIN THE GAME regardless of the CLEAR rule breaking that was and still is supported by video evidence) - i didnt ESCALATE the situation any furthur for this player - i let him know why he was in breach of the rule - and how he could EASILY come within our RULEs with some adjustment and still maintain his style of play... DID i have the right ot BITCH and the PROOF for some sort of COMPENSATION for my loss? absolutely! BUT I DIDNT DESERVE THE WIN - so i let it go... in the end - he will not break that rule again - and i have the LOSS which i rightfully deserved!
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Re: Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

Post by Rui_F on Mon Jan 03, 2011 6:47 pm

Actually I have only received a message from you once and while you may have been mad/upset about the game you were in no way obnoxious towards me personally and my post was not meant as any kind of attack towards anybody in particular.

I understand the need to vent sometimes and don't mind it as long as people are intelligent enough to realize there is a live person at the other end. And some people want to act like assholes, personally I don't like dealing with assholes unless somebody is paying me to do so.

This is supposed to be a way for me to wind down a little bit and look at the pretty colors on the screen and enjoy a hobby. So my "rule" is a real quick way to get rid of some of the assholes around here, if people get kicked out of enough leagues then people get the message no more assholes whether by eliminations or reprogramming their choice.
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Re: Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

Post by saastar on Mon Jan 03, 2011 7:37 pm

by phantomshark on Mon Jan 03, 2011 2:51 pm

I feel very strongly that the subbing the QB rule is not a good one. The Jets sub in Brad Smith all the time, and use him in both Wildcat and standard packages. Tebow comes in sometimes for Denver, VIck used to sub in for Kolb before he became the starter. If the WIldcat sets were more extensive in the game then I might agree, but for now not allowing the backup QB into the game occasionally would serve no purpose other than to make another arbitrary rule. Oh and for the record, I do not sub my QBs in any of my leagues, but that doesn't mean I shouldn't be able to if I don't want to.


thank u phantom shark.. my point exactly.. atleast im not the only one who see other people come in to play the QB position and some times they are not always in wildcat formation.. they are in goaline, shotgun or other formations.. so like phantom said also that if the wildcat worked better like they did in madden 10.. where u could run the wildcat successful out of the arizona playbook then yeah i mite agree.. but that aint the case.. and i completely agree that we shouldnt be limited to only making a switch that we have to stick with if we sub in a mobile QB to help get away from pressure...

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Re: Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

Post by mblammers on Mon Jan 03, 2011 7:53 pm

This has been discussed a LOT already in previous threads, but I'll repeat it because qb subbing is really frustrating:

The point isn't whether or how much real teams situationally sub a qb. The point is that your opponent has no way of knowing when you do so.

So, if I'm playing against Carson Palmer ALL GAME LONG, and then in a key situation, my opponent suddenly puts in Tim Tebow, I'm not going to notice. When this happens, it is a total surprise based on a programming error. Because EA doesn't have the smarts to give us better pre-play information on personnel changes, the whole gaming experience gets screwed.

I suppose the proposed rule could incorporate something requiring a pause for notice or a txt message from your opponent giving you a heads up or something, but that seems really unworkable.

Actually, now that I think about it why not? I never use all my pauses. For those of you who really need to put in a different qb, you should be allowed to do it if you pause and give notice. That gives you 5 qb subs a game. Its not perfect, but its better than none, and it seems like a fair compromise. If you use a pause for another reason, then you lose the ability to sub a qb.


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Re: Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

Post by phantomshark on Mon Jan 03, 2011 8:18 pm

I'll say it again, I hate it. I just played an opponent who used 2 different QBs. First thing I did each play was see what number was walking up under center, and then calling an audible if I needed to. When Brad Smith comes in the game for the Jets, you never know where he's going to be until he lines up, if it's at QB you know the D switches its call.

If they were to go as far as legislating when I play a backup, I'd say good-bye, that's going way past the line of sim. Why not tell me what plays I have to run too?

P.S. Explain to me why this is any worse than someone using a power back and then subbing in Reggie Bush. Or going 2 HB package and instead of Tony Richardson, Felix Jones is catching a pass from the FB spot. You have no idea which backs are in until they line up. Why is that any better or worse than the QB? Get in the habit of checking their skill personnel as soon as they break the huddle and adjust accordingly

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Re: Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

Post by Cheddah_Cheez on Mon Jan 03, 2011 8:43 pm

phantomshark wrote:I'll say it again, I hate it. I just played an opponent who used 2 different QBs. First thing I did each play was see what number was walking up under center, and then calling an audible if I needed to. When Brad Smith comes in the game for the Jets, you never know where he's going to be until he lines up, if it's at QB you know the D switches its call.

If they were to go as far as legislating when I play a backup, I'd say good-bye, that's going way past the line of sim. Why not tell me what plays I have to run too?

P.S. Explain to me why this is any worse than someone using a power back and then subbing in Reggie Bush. Or going 2 HB package and instead of Tony Richardson, Felix Jones is catching a pass from the FB spot. You have no idea which backs are in until they line up. Why is that any better or worse than the QB? Get in the habit of checking their skill personnel as soon as they break the huddle and adjust accordingly

A. This isn't the forum to discuss this, there's a topic for that. It's called QB sub rule. This topic is for rule proposals and voting.

B. If you look at that topic all the points you brought up have already been refuted. The short of it is there IS a HUGE difference between a QB sub and a RB sub. The subs you spoke of in an earlier message on this thread are ALL specialty packages. Vick coming in never worked for Philly, which is why they abandoned it...same with Tebow. Brad Smith DOES NOT come in to play QB on regular plays either. People aren't using their QB subs in this manner anyway. They use them on 3rd and long to run the same plays they would any other time, they just want the option to run with the ball. Just because you see those things from 3 NFL teams 5% of the time does not mean you should be able to do it in the game. If you want phantom, I'll explain to you exactly why in a PM or even a sepearate topic. Or you can look up the existing topic. But THIS topic isn't for that discussion. It's for members of the GC to vote on it.
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Re: Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

Post by saastar on Mon Jan 03, 2011 8:51 pm

lol.. phantom i have said the same exact words before when me and cheddah had this exact same topic like a month and a half ago or somthing like that...

mblammers- cheddah suggested the same thing that u did.. but if u had to tell ur opponent when ur subbing in a faster qb then there would be no point in subbing him in.. like phantom said..

i also agree with what phantom said about the whole power back and a fast hb.. it is basically the same thing ur asking if the qb is coming in.. and if ur going to make a rule saying u can only switch and have to keep him in unless by injury then u should have to do so with hb's... bc the same could be said u say like a 3 wr 1 te 1 hb set.. and i come out looking to guard 3wr with 3 cbs.. and come to find out he is lining up 5 wide with a hb like brian westbrook as 5 wr which is legit but i saw 3wr 1te 1 hb. so im only prepared to cover 3 wrs not 3wrs and a quick hb like westbrook so i have a LB on westbrook who isnt as fast now and has to cover him down field... so samething applys to hbs as qbs to me... if ur going to make a rule about it u should have to do so about hbs...

but i do think it would be retarded to do so... i wouldnt leave any lgs bc of it but it would be a total waste of my picks to draft a pocket passer and a mobile qb...

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Re: Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

Post by saastar on Mon Jan 03, 2011 8:52 pm

my bad cheddah ill copy and paste my reply to the qb sub rule..

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Re: Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

Post by Cheddah_Cheez on Mon Jan 03, 2011 9:07 pm

Thanks fellas.
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Re: Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

Post by GREENERRRR on Mon Jan 03, 2011 10:44 pm

are all the messages copy and pasted to the QB sub thread??? if so i will delet the messsages that are off topic...
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Re: Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

Post by Child_Please4285 on Mon Jan 03, 2011 11:05 pm

punt rule you suggested is way to complicated i see guys not understanding the simple rule that inplace now and the part where conceding and pausing the game then writing on boards is 2 much also
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Re: Designated Rule changes to submit to General Council- GC please vote as of Jan 2nd 2011

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